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Post by levine on Mar 21, 2024 16:04:17 GMT -6
I wonder if we're going to have to make a choice between KAT (28) or NAW (25) and Naz (24) as soon as next season?
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Post by Bonecrusher on Mar 21, 2024 23:01:00 GMT -6
I wonder if we're going to have to make a choice between KAT (28) or NAW (25) and Naz (24) as soon as next season? This is why I mentioned starting NAW over Jaden the other day.
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Post by Nick K on Mar 22, 2024 2:12:35 GMT -6
NAW was my pick in the Culver draft at #11 or so. I argued like crazy for him then with very few follower's. People expect way too much way too soon. It takes these guys time. 3-4 years most times. He just didn't have consistency. He's improved so much, like Jake Reid. NAW deserves the money within reason. Right now he's more important than McD.
To have a sixth man like Reid and NAW is crucial. You gotta have it.
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Post by jojo on Mar 22, 2024 4:49:17 GMT -6
I would choose NAW plus Naz over KAT. They probably won’t make that choice till after next year when NAWs contract is up. He might get paid as much as Naz.
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salty
Full Member
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Post by salty on Mar 22, 2024 7:30:11 GMT -6
I would choose NAW plus Naz over KAT. They probably won’t make that choice till after next year when NAWs contract is up. He might get paid as much as Naz. That is such an easy choice, but I am worried it is now too late to trade Kat.
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Post by Nick K on Mar 22, 2024 10:36:13 GMT -6
I'll say it again, it would be a huge mistake to trade Kat unless what you got back in return was too good to pass up. That rarely happens. As the old saying goes, whoever gets the best player in the deal wins.
The numbers Kat puts up as a 2nd fiddle to Ant are excellent by any standards. We need his size and rebounding too. We're having enough issues handling size right now as it is.
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Post by levine on Mar 22, 2024 10:38:03 GMT -6
I'll say it again, it would be a huge mistake to trade Kat unless what you got back in return was to good to pass up. That rarely happens. As the old saying goes, whoever gets the best player in the deal wins. The numbers Kat puts up as a 2nd fiddle to Ant are excellent by any standards. We need his size and rebounding too. We're having enough issues handling size right now as it is. So you'd keep KAT and let Naz and NAW go if that's what it comes to?
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Post by Nick K on Mar 22, 2024 10:42:58 GMT -6
I'll say it again, it would be a huge mistake to trade Kat unless what you got back in return was to good to pass up. That rarely happens. As the old saying goes, whoever gets the best player in the deal wins. The numbers Kat puts up as a 2nd fiddle to Ant are excellent by any standards. We need his size and rebounding too. We're having enough issues handling size right now as it is. So you'd keep KAT and let Naz and NAW go if that's what it comes to? It's not going to come to that. They will find a way.
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Post by levine on Mar 22, 2024 11:28:04 GMT -6
So you'd keep KAT and let Naz and NAW go if that's what it comes to? It's not going to come to that. They will find a way. So you expect Lore to spend like the Warriors? Or is this another "everyone has enough money and should all take discounts because they love Minnesota" takes?
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Post by levine on Mar 22, 2024 11:32:24 GMT -6
Interesting fact: Joel Embiid has played in more games the past 5 years than KAT has.
Scary thought as KAT is in the 1st year of his Super Max deal.
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jr
Junior Member
Posts: 297
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Post by jr on Mar 22, 2024 11:46:59 GMT -6
NAW was my pick in the Culver draft at #11 or so. I argued like crazy for him then with very few follower's. People expect way too much way too soon. It takes these guys time. 3-4 years most times. He just didn't have consistency. He's improved so much, like Jake Reid. NAW deserves the money within reason. Right now he's more important than McD. To have a sixth man like Reid and NAW is crucial. You gotta have it. Marney Gellner did an interview with NAW and he is a very likeable person. A nice and thoughtful guy, is close to family, including Shay, well spoken, etc. etc. He's very easy to root for.
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Post by quinn on Mar 22, 2024 12:30:36 GMT -6
Interesting fact: Joel Embiid has played in more games the past 5 years than KAT has. Scary thought as KAT is in the 1st year of his Super Max deal. I got into it with someone on Twitter at one point because I had said that KAT was injury prone. The guy tried arguing that he's gotten unlucky with major injuries but that he's not injury prone... What?? It's really not a good spot to be in with KAT, who I will continue to say is injury prone. He really has just had a hard time staying on the court. It's really hard too for the FO to make a decision on this roster construction without KAT on the court too. There's been so much good this season, but it doesn't really matter until the playoffs start.
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Post by levine on Mar 22, 2024 13:15:57 GMT -6
Interesting fact: Joel Embiid has played in more games the past 5 years than KAT has. Scary thought as KAT is in the 1st year of his Super Max deal. I got into it with someone on Twitter at one point because I had said that KAT was injury prone. The guy tried arguing that he's gotten unlucky with major injuries but that he's not injury prone... What?? It's really not a good spot to be in with KAT, who I will continue to say is injury prone. He really has just had a hard time staying on the court. It's really hard too for the FO to make a decision on this roster construction without KAT on the court too. There's been so much good this season, but it doesn't really matter until the playoffs start. Yup. KAT was an iron man his first 4 years, but he's become increasingly brittle as the years have gone by.
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Post by kingsxman on Mar 23, 2024 12:18:30 GMT -6
Interesting fact: Joel Embiid has played in more games the past 5 years than KAT has. Scary thought as KAT is in the 1st year of his Super Max deal. I got into it with someone on Twitter at one point because I had said that KAT was injury prone. The guy tried arguing that he's gotten unlucky with major injuries but that he's not injury prone... What?? It's really not a good spot to be in with KAT, who I will continue to say is injury prone. He really has just had a hard time staying on the court. It's really hard too for the FO to make a decision on this roster construction without KAT on the court too. There's been so much good this season, but it doesn't really matter until the playoffs start. Ah...this is where I will disagree. While I wish KAT was playing...this is an EXCELLENT time for the front office to see what this team looks like without KAT. It actually gives them more info on making a decision on roster construction moving forward. If we dont lose much with Naz playing the 4 instead of KAT, it gives the office all the ammo it needs to make the decision to potentially move KAT for pieces that shore up the team elsewhere.
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Post by Bonecrusher on Mar 24, 2024 14:19:53 GMT -6
I'll say it again, it would be a huge mistake to trade Kat unless what you got back in return was to good to pass up. That rarely happens. As the old saying goes, whoever gets the best player in the deal wins. The numbers Kat puts up as a 2nd fiddle to Ant are excellent by any standards. We need his size and rebounding too. We're having enough issues handling size right now as it is. So you'd keep KAT and let Naz and NAW go if that's what it comes to? Never. We are showing what we can do without KAT and we are holding our own and it's forced ANT to become the man. I would see if we can move KAT during the draft and get some solid picks. We really don't have a toxic contract to pair up but an expiring would be nice for the owners to avoid the luxury tax (if possible).
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Post by XRaySpecs on Mar 25, 2024 8:04:09 GMT -6
I see that Daigneault is now the hands down favorite to win COY and Finch has fallen to 4th.
I just need to rant a little. The Thunder are very good and have the best future of any team in the league. Daigneault is obviously a very good coach. It's more than a little annoying though how the Wolves season is still being viewed seemingly as an accident with no one really getting "credit" for it. Finch isn't getting credit and Connelly sure isn't either given the negative shroud of the Rudy trade carrying over from last year. Daigneault added a top 10 center to his team in Chet for this year. Finch got the same roster this year that everyone said was flawed last year. We're a half game back of OKC after going 6-3 without KAT. That should be 7-2 if no Rudy T vs. Cavs and the other 2 losses were short handed losses to LAL on the road and the champs by 3.
Wolves and OKC were essentially equal in record last year. Wolves easily beat them in the play in. Much has been made of Wolves not doing anything in playoffs. At least they were there. OKC gets all the love for making a huge jump this year, but so have the Wolves. It seems that everyone is so in love with the Thunder's future that they're heaping that love onto this season's results. Wolves bad buzz from the Rudy trade, how people don't like our style, and our mediocre offense negatively influence perception of Wolves and Finch through association. If our style isn't the "right" way to play, shouldn't Finch get more credit for making it work?
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Post by levine on Mar 25, 2024 8:49:31 GMT -6
I think it’s a combination of two things.
OKC wasn’t expected to be this good, this fast. They’re a year or more ahead of where anyone projected them. They’re the “darlings” of the league.
With us, people don’t want to admit they were wrong about us. Everyone blasted the Rudy trade, the team construction, our intelligence as a team, etc. it’s an ego blow to have to do a 180, so people are holding us to an unfair standard - basically we’re going to have to do some playoff damage to get the majority to start admitting it.
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Post by levine on Mar 25, 2024 9:41:44 GMT -6
Interesting numbers:
Wolves have the 7th best Offense the past 2 weeks.
8-3 in games w/o KAT.
Naz doing what we wish KAT would. Averaging 8 3PA/game in his 5 starts.
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Post by quinn on Mar 25, 2024 10:01:08 GMT -6
Interesting numbers: Wolves have the 7th best Offense the past 2 weeks. 8-3 in games w/o KAT. Naz doing what we wish KAT would. Averaging 8 3PA/game in his 5 starts. I think part of it too is that Naz is a much more decisive player than KAT. KAT is patient to his (and the offense's) detriment. He waits for the double to come to open up someone else. He waits for an angle to drive. He waits until he's perfectly open to shoot the 3. Naz just goes. He plays classic Spurs basketball. It helps bend the defense and open up looks for himself and others. It's something I've wanted KAT to do for a long time. Be a quick decision-maker. I think more than anything that's what kills the flow of the offense. Ant and KAT are the 2 biggest offenders too. Naz is one of the best at it.
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Post by XRaySpecs on Mar 25, 2024 11:02:38 GMT -6
Interesting numbers: Wolves have the 7th best Offense the past 2 weeks. 8-3 in games w/o KAT. Naz doing what we wish KAT would. Averaging 8 3PA/game in his 5 starts. And the D rating is right there with our season avg of just under 109 (6th in league in last 2 weeks). The point is that we're a better offense and doing the same on D and this hasn't been a stretch with gimme games.
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Post by XRaySpecs on Mar 25, 2024 11:09:32 GMT -6
Interesting numbers: Wolves have the 7th best Offense the past 2 weeks. 8-3 in games w/o KAT. Naz doing what we wish KAT would. Averaging 8 3PA/game in his 5 starts. I think part of it too is that Naz is a much more decisive player than KAT. KAT is patient to his (and the offense's) detriment. He waits for the double to come to open up someone else. He waits for an angle to drive. He waits until he's perfectly open to shoot the 3. Naz just goes. He plays classic Spurs basketball. It helps bend the defense and open up looks for himself and others. It's something I've wanted KAT to do for a long time. Be a quick decision-maker. I think more than anything that's what kills the flow of the offense. Ant and KAT are the 2 biggest offenders too. Naz is one of the best at it. Yep. Naz was often referred to as a poor man's KAT as a big who could shoot. KAT had always been the better shooter hands down, but this year he's actually not. They're shooting the same %, but Naz shoots more of them. You can't not call that better. Additionally with Rudy on board and both playing more 4, Naz's ability to guard more varied players has helped narrow the gap. Naz can guard a guy like Kuminga a lot better than KAT can. Neither are great defenders and have similar issues with fouling, but Naz is more versatile.
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Post by XRaySpecs on Mar 25, 2024 11:19:00 GMT -6
It's not going to come to that. They will find a way. So you expect Lore to spend like the Warriors? Or is this another "everyone has enough money and should all take discounts because they love Minnesota" takes? It gets harder to justify watching the Wolves the last 2 weeks. Naz is giving so much of what KAT does at significantly cheaper salary. Naz won't be cheap after next year, but he won't get huge money either. KAT will cost more than Naz AND NAW combined AND probably what Kyle gets this offseason (likely from some other team). Even if the Wolves wanted to trade him though...where and for who? Toronto? Charlotte? NY?
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Post by XRaySpecs on Mar 25, 2024 11:30:42 GMT -6
I think it’s a combination of two things. OKC wasn’t expected to be this good, this fast. They’re a year or more ahead of where anyone projected them. They’re the “darlings” of the league. With us, people don’t want to admit they were wrong about us. Everyone blasted the Rudy trade, the team construction, our intelligence as a team, etc. it’s an ego blow to have to do a 180, so people are holding us to an unfair standard - basically we’re going to have to do some playoff damage to get the majority to start admitting it. Yep. The latter is certainly true in regards to why Finch and the Wolves are less celebrated. So many guys blasted the trade and it's hard to walk that back ego wise.
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Post by levine on Mar 25, 2024 12:32:58 GMT -6
So you expect Lore to spend like the Warriors? Or is this another "everyone has enough money and should all take discounts because they love Minnesota" takes? It gets harder to justify watching the Wolves the last 2 weeks. Naz is giving so much of what KAT does at significantly cheaper salary. Naz won't be cheap after next year, but he won't get huge money either. KAT will cost more than Naz AND NAW combined AND probably what Kyle gets this offseason (likely from some other team). Even if the Wolves wanted to trade him though...where and for who? Toronto? Charlotte? NY? You'd have to find a well under the cap team with draft picks and cheap talent. I guess even expirings would work. If the idea is to save money to afford NAW and Naz, we can't be taking back any long-term big contracts.
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Post by Bonecrusher on Mar 25, 2024 12:43:07 GMT -6
So you expect Lore to spend like the Warriors? Or is this another "everyone has enough money and should all take discounts because they love Minnesota" takes? It gets harder to justify watching the Wolves the last 2 weeks. Naz is giving so much of what KAT does at significantly cheaper salary. Naz won't be cheap after next year, but he won't get huge money either. KAT will cost more than Naz AND NAW combined AND probably what Kyle gets this offseason (likely from some other team). Even if the Wolves wanted to trade him though...where and for who? Toronto? Charlotte? NY? I target Brooklyn or NY since that is closer to home and not in the Western Conference but what do you trade for? Another PF to backup Reid? I would hope for several draft picks with at least one being unrestricted and one or more being restricted only to top 5, but I just don't see any player/players another team is going to give up a player we really want or need.
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