2024-25 Season Thread

This is my recollection.

2018-19 FOM happens, (CP's second year in Houston where they leaned into small ball spread O and Chris couldn't get around guys on his own, Wolves second Jimmy year, Jazz have that weird d against Harden where they're playing behind him because the league broke basketball).

In 2019-20, Prosas becomes GM and essentially tries to be the Rockets. This is the year we spread the court and had Wiggins initiating, which under the new FOM wasn't bad other than who he was kicking it to (I believe this was a soft tank holding Kat out longer than we could have if we were competing), which we luck out getting Ant.

2020-21 Ant's rookie years, Ryan Saunders at the helm, we lean into the spread, stand around offense, and everyone look like morons, followed by a stretch where they start getting Ricky downhill more, sprinkle in a few more set screening actions, and are playing well, D-Lo coming off the bench with Naz, and I want to say J-Mac? Finch comes in, and his stated goal is to work through Towns more. That season they keep it fairly vanilla, he talks about bumpers, and doing less, but we kept some horns action given the limited off-season we had the year before, and Finch just coming in.

2021-22 was the asterisk year, when the league was decimated by COVID on top of load management, and if you were reasonably healthy and trying that night you were in the mix for play-in. This is the season OKC lost a game by 70 points. The offense was predicated on Kat and D-Lo being primary initiators. If you look at Kat's offensive fouls, they increased under Finch because we wanted him to do more driving and playmaking. That's the number one thing Finch did here. Thibs, and Mitchell were not doing that.

Now part of that was FOM, because literally every player in the league could get to the rim now. The regular season offensives were exploding, and it took me a long time to pinpoint the exact rule, because it was ghosted by the NBA Intellectual Dark Web. This is when you heard things like maybe it just makes more sense to have five guys that can score, or props to Houston for going for it during the Golden State run, or the league is just so skilled now, Ja can just fly at the rim and dunk in traffic all night. It is one of the greatest tragedies of our life time and cover up in sports. It'd be like if baseball was behind juiceing A-Rod's forehead.

2022-23 we're still dicking around with flow putting the ball in Kat and D-Lo's hands, Kat is hurt, misses 50 games, the National Media tells us Kat and Gobert didn't work.

2023-24 we improve a lot under improved structure, spacing, and replacing D-Lo with NAW and Mike. We have one more step to take and that's simply to mix in some more screening to get our initiators (guards) downhill in space to playmake. Last year it did work, and somehow the national media was still able to tell us it did not. We were in the WCF and if Ant is healthy likely more. They all told us Suns and Nuggets are better. As far as health luck goes, no one thought Suns had any chance of those three being healthy for a full season, and they weren't, on top of having zero  depth.

This is why I've ranted about FOM so often. In theory if the league is leaning away from that (again has not formally announced) fewer teams will be able to get away with the iso flow that was so in vogue for six seasons. That does not mean it's the same exact play every time down, but some games that is what you're doing. We don't have to be Dallas, or Houston's Harden, but we have to mix in things that make the game easier for everyone, but especially Ant. Or like if you say you want Ant to cut more, a coach is able to make that happen.

Finch has never made offense easier on Kat or Ant, although there were a handful of more scripted halves, that IMO they looked much improved in. If you want to flow and to piddle around against the tanking teams fine, but we have to have more to our offense when we're playing better d. Especially after the change in emphasis on fouls.

The best way to describe it as Kat as a hub versus initiator. Tim Duncan would tear us up as a screener and passer working the lower trap.

You can love getting a beer with Chris Finch, but he is why we tried to see if Kat is Giannis or Joker, and the lack of structure and set actions made it extremely difficult for Kat and everyone else on the team to find a rhythm night to night.

Even the press conference at the end of last year, he's like well the offense was clicking in pre-season, and than when the regular season started people started being more concerned with their numbers. One of the ways young guys learn offense, is a coach showing them what works, by getting reps in game, and then down the road, maybe they have the experience to start handling more of those duties, like how Mike and Kyle would just get into things on their own. Finch loved them because they would do that, you have to show Jaden and Ant what works, and that includes "calling their number."

It's also interesting to think about how teams played pre-FOM and post, so think about everyone drafted before Ant's era (Zach, Wiggins, Kat) grew up with two bigs inside the arc and an offense. Everyone post that is just three on three nonsense.

One of the reasons point guards often have a better feel for the game is because they grow up with the ball in their hands. From an early age they learn how the d reacts to the ball, and how to move the floor. There are savant level playmakers (Double R) that make it seem like real life magic. It's also about do you have the handle to do it, in Zach and Wigs case I wouldn't mistake them for point guards, but they also grew up playing off ball, and running more set things to create space next to a point guard. D-Lo sometimes wouldn't do things because he didn't have speed to get open, or drive the rock effectively, but he also made some wtf plays, and the lolly gagging around was incredibly frustrating.

I am more excited about is the league back, than are we contending now because I don't think we are. The Timberwolves with Kat were under tremendous pressure to win. I was excited about that. Now anything we do is gravy, and maybe some of our young guys will show flashes. Finch is going to have to set picks for Rob though if they want to maximize him. The good news is true ball handlers might have more value again.

Probably should have had J-Mac out there with Kyle in the non-Ant minutes, and Kyle in the closing group going dire effectively replacing Minnesota Mike. Now we are generating shots for Kat and Ant against a shifting d. Now Mavs are still taking away the paint for drives, but we just weren't making them react to anything.

I do not need Finch to be fired (though almost all coaches are that first Rudy year given the number of terrible losses Portland who was trying to lose for Wemby was literally a historic loss). What I need him to do is get back to basics that have worked in basketball for I don't know millions of years.

You know D-Lo also came up in an era of posts inside the arc and O, I think he will be a better basketball player if that's where Lakers are heading. That doesn't mean he averages more points, but their success is LeBron and AD obviously. Maybe if those two are healthy Steph says hey why not LA, I can make a second documentary about myself while I'm still in the league.

Listened to the trade press conference. Randle really seems to like Finch. Julius mentioned Finch several times including saying he was a "genius" and was a favorite coach to play for. He directed questions back to being able to work with Finch again.

I'm sure we'll debate KAT vs. Randle for a long time, but I do think I'll enjoy our style of play more. Randle is just better at initiating and does a good job of spraying the ball out to shooters which we now have basically everywhere except Rudy. We're going to shoot more 3s maybe by a lot. Randle doesn't make them near as much as KAT, but he gets them up as well as KAT did. And, we're adding Donte, Rob, and Ingles to a rotation in place of lower attempt guys like Kyle (huge upgrade), Monte, and JMac. Spacing should be better overall which helps everyone. Donte and Julius are just hard nosed guys too. I think fans are going to like watching them more. KAT's highs were great, but he has lower lows I think and those won't be missed.

I am assuming the new guys won't play tomorrow?

I agree on the excitement.  There was understandably a sense of concern for many as the Wolves were running back a team that wasn't good enough and lost players/got older.  Trying to replace them with youth was risky so for me anyway, I was more nervous than excited.  Now, we've reshuffled and have more depth.  While it may play out that we're just not as good without KAT, there's also more a sense that the ceiling might actually be higher if the new team synergizes.  What if Randle yo-yo's to being a "good" 3 pt shooter again?  If he hits 38% on 5 a game AND brings the initiation/passing stuff, that's a better KAT right?  Add Donte's shooting, defense and intangibles to that and we could be better.  That could be is the excitement even if it's not the likely outcome.

I think that pick is a great piece. I don't believe it won't convey. Like you said, Detroit is tired of being bad. They're going to have to try to be good soon or they risk losing Cade and any good will they have with the fans. The protections dropping when they should supposedly be better will be a boon for us because, while I don't think we'd trade it this year, I think next year, we'll try to package it with our 2026 pick to get a player next year when we have our (or Utah's) first depending on what happens with the swap. There's a real chance that pick could be a lottery pick as soon as next year.

Another thing...who gets cut?  Wolves are at 16 players after the 3 for 1 trade.  Dozier seems like the likely casualty given that his contract is not guaranteed, but we know Connelly loves him and he's got secondary ball handling ability.  KBD is the other candidate, but he's guaranteed so it doesn't save any money/tax.  He's got more size and length as a combo forward.  He wasn't good at all last year when PHX really needed him to be a depth guy and was eventually trading him to BRK.  He had a decent year with the Spurs 2 years ago though.  With Donte, we may not need Dozier's secondary ball handling as much so my guess is that Dozier is gone.

Hopefully he likes corner three’s, no mid-range and renting.

Can we sticky this thread?

What point are you trying to make in sharing this quote?

Wolves are still paying a hefty luxury tax bill as they still have the 2nd highest payroll in the league.

Despite your opinion, the grading of the trade is a lot more mixed indicating it's close to neutral one way or the other. So, the idea that the Wolves aren't taking a step back still holds.